I went out with a guy who was more Israeli than American. One time he went out with a girl and she ordered a taxi for herself instead of taking a bus.
She got really upset when he asked if he get a ride in the taxi since his house was on the way and she was ordering a taxi anyhow. I am curious about your statement about taxis, Person1. I mostly go out with Americans though, not Israelis. The truth is that I have usually lived in far-out places so a taxi would have been expensive, but I think this was the case even when I lived more centrally. Why are you so surprised by that?
I suppose Americans living in Israel do things differently.
Also maybe at a certain age guys do things less by the book, which is probably a blessing except for the taxi. American yeshivish bochorim, by and large, do not have their own cars. I was surprised by the girls who thought the guy was cheap for not ordering a taxi. I mainly date chutznikim, so they probably do things differently. I am referring to all my years of dating even when I was younger. However, when I was younger, most of the guys I dated were not really Yeshivish, and the ones who were Yeshivish were usually bt, so that might also be different.
My comments about dating in EY are mainly based on my own experiences, and I am not in typical Israeli Yeshivish circles. I do have the impression that typical Yeshivish Israelis do things similarly, but I will have to check with my friends who are now at the stage of having typical Israeli Yeshivish kids in shidduchim. In the car alone. The concept of tznius encompasses a lot more than yichud. You have to do what you have to do in order to get married, but you should make sure that the dating process is conducted as tzniusly as possible and practical.
I agree with him on that. What I am unsure about is:. Even though dating should be as tznius as is possible while still being effective, different people need different things in order for dating to be effective. But the question of what is effective has to be taken into account.
But maybe for most Yeshivish 19 year olds, there is no reason why they have to date by car. If they go in the same car service, the car service drivers are frum guys who live in Lakewood, so it would be kind of awkward. What do you think of dating via Skype this should solve the problem. This way a girl from Israel can date a boy from Brazil from the privacy of their home, saving both of them time and money. What do you think? Anybody want to give me feedback.
If the car is park in a secluded area or driving down deserted streets there might be a Yichud problem. You need to see the person not their image on a computer. As far as the issue, if you were driving solo from Ashdod to Haifa and the nice neighborhood seforim store owner guy your family knew for years needed to get there too, would you offer him a ride?
Questions tagged [tznius-modesty]
Or feel comfortable if he asked you for a ride. I think it depends what level people are on. No one in a MO community is going to adhere to a chumra of not driving in a car together. But someone in Meah Shearim might. In the USA most people have a car or access to a car. Or does it not work that way anymore? Or is the point that he would first come to the house and then they would go out by public transportation?
Are a lot of the boys and girls who date this way by car uncomfortable with it? Would they be more comfortable not dating this way? I have thought about that. On the other hand, the counter-argument might be: Dating via skype save time, money and is less intimidating then dating in person.
Also you avoid Yichud and the possibility of touching. There are aspects to the person themselves that only come through when you see the person and interact with them. So I do hear your point, Joseph. I also think that the very Yeshivish people do check things out well beforehand. That is why they only have to date a few times — since their parents already checked out the guy beforehand and already feel that he would be an appropriate person for their daughter to marry which means that they would trust him to take her on a date.
Joseph, most Israeli Yeshiva Bochurim do not have driver licenses, most yeshivos do not let their bochurim get one.
Besides the cost of the car, insurance is very expensive, gas is about twice what it costs in the US, and just getting a license is a fortune- you have to take something like 28 mandatory lessons, besides the test and fees, so it can cost thousands of shekels. WTP — she could be going to a simcha. Also, not everyone gets that dressed up, especially in EY. Therefore it makes more sense to take a car. Other aspects I have felt are not so tznius such as the girls getting decked out over the top but the actual driving was never an issue.
It also allows you to see many aspects of the person which you would otherwise have a hard time finding out.
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In lobbies and similar venues there is too much pressure to be a stiff and proper. LU- note I said especially during sefira. I have a feeling that this happens a lot there. Perhaps there is a bias influenced by the general culture that promotes the single lifestyle. I would not be surprised if in some cases the intimacy that results after long courtships end up in a sexual relationship. In fact I have heard that some single women have begun using a Mikva to avoid the severe Halachic violation of having a sexual relationship with a Niddah.
I am not being judgmental here.
Just stating what I believe to be a fact. In fact they are closer to the Yeshiva model. Which is of benefit to them in terms of getting married.
tznius modesty - Is it proper to supply a picture of a girl prior to dating? - Mi Yodeya
In fact I think that their model of dating is the correct one — if my assumptions are right. I say this knowing that I will be accused of promoting my own Hashkafos. I will take that risk because I really do believe it is the better model. More about this later. In the non Chasidic Yeshiva world women start dating at about age 19; men at about age The choices for men therefore include the entire range of women ages 19 to In theory there are now 5 young women for every eligible young male in the Yeshiva world. And for the 23 year old Yeshiva man — the younger the woman the better.
There are other reasons for this crisis. More about that later too. I have no clue how to deal with the world of MO dating. The right wing Yeshiva world, however, seems to be the more fixable.
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